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UK Drama Tour 1980

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    #16
    I can totally understand one not liking the Drama era or any other era. And true, the music matters first and the 'brand' is of lesser important compared to that. Yes started as one thing and were not that thing by the time of Drama. I know a lot of people were let down by that lineup/album/era. But that was the first album I'd heard, so I didn't have a 'main sequence' to judge it by. I worked backwards, and found out who was who later. The comings of new members always added new flavors to the Yes stew, and the goings took away flavors as well. We all get different nutrients from the Yes stew, some love the futuristic 80's stuff and some despise it. But it's great to share these views, even if we all have different takes on line-ups or albums. No wrong answer, as long as one has a passion for the music and it gives them good vibes. Big Generator for example to me sounds aquatic/oceanic in places, the keyboards are like a dimly lit neon aquarium or science center in the city. But that's just me, I don't expect anyone else to think like that, it's all perspective. Many will just hear Journey & Foreigner in the Yes/West material, and that's ok, they're not wrong either. Big Generator for me, though = the moray eel.

    I'm thinking that by the time of the UK tour, Yes were spent. That year 1980 saw the exit of their irreplaceable vocalist as well as their star keyboardist, followed immediately by having to deal with the recording of a new album and the integration of two new members, followed by a booked-in-advance tour - events all in rapid succession. I can imagine that by the end of that tour and the end of that year they were worn out. I had heard a boot of one of the UK gigs, and yeah, Horn did sound dire. Didn't they drop 'Parallels' because he couldn't cut it? But the MSG shows - vocals were good. So long live Drama.

    As for the direction set by Relayer(a favorite of mine too), Wakeman coming back may have been just as calculated as any move towards having the brand on the charts. Patrick Moraz was one of only a few who never came back to the band, which is a shame. He and Bruford really were the two most jazz-inclined members and it's too bad they weren't there at the same time. And just like with the Drama band, which never had a followup album, Relayer line-up also never had a second offering. They did the Yessolos instead. But it's more than just the line-up, the direction they went in with Relayer had some danger to it. The fusion elements, the jagged edge and unpredictability. One of the best. And it has To Be Over, probably in my top ten list of Yes tracks. I agree Yes should have stayed there in Relayer mode a little bit longer.

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      #17
      Originally posted by Ash Armstrong View Post

      The playing of the principals was fine, Downes' technical shortcomings notwithstanding, it was the current material I didn't like, and Horn's vocals were awful. I'm not nor have ever been an admirer of Trevor Horn in any capacity, on whichever side of the studio window he sits.
      While I'm not overfond of the direction they were taking with Tormato, in keeping with the times I suppose, I found Drama almost desperate in its attempt to reinvent the band of the Yes Album/Fragile period, and reinvent the success they'd enjoyed, I'd always hoped they'd look to pursuing the direction set with Relayer, but with Wakeman coming back in that was never going to happen. I had to look elsewhere for that fulfillment, in classical music, avant-garde and mainstream, jazz, dark-wave, and ambient, throughout the 1980s. With the arrival of the music video, rapid returns on investment, short-term impact, corporatisation, image-management and marketing to the fore to name just a few factors, I took refuge from it in other areas.
      When the former-members of Yes became Trevor Rabin's band, and subsequently sought to sell themselves as "Yes", all my perspectives were realised and my take on what was happening confirmed. I'm first and foremost a music lover, not a brand fan. I didn't like the music, so the collective name it adopted was irrelevant to me, and that's still the case now.
      There are any number of authors who have written and published novels under various different names, novels quite different in style and genre and for a different audience, from those they might ordinarily be associated with, and do so in part to distance themselves from those different styles, genre/s and audiences. Quite a few wrote soft-porn...
      That's sort of what happened with various members of Yes for me, only they stuck with the same name. Regrettable. A somewhat similar situation exists now as well, but only as far as I'm concerned. My view of these things, insofar as that's of any consequence, need not trouble anyone else, and I'm not open to persuasion towards a different take on any of it.
      The collaboration with Trevor Horn in 1980 gave Yes not only a second trademark voice (unfortunatley heard not often enough) but it also was leading to the last real mind-blowing development of Steve Howe's vocabulary on guitar. Even if I like the five albums from Keys-Studio to Fly From Here he has been stagnating, fortunatley on a very high niveau. The real progression came after the work with Trevor Horn on Drama had paved the way for Yes' second great era.

      But that just to resonate to your sonic-musings. We agree to disagree - and persuasion would be the end of yesfans.com


      Originally posted by Gtkgasman View Post

      😊 I believe he was just trying to say he liked it.
      You mean I failed and should try harder to say that I like it?
      Last edited by PeterCologne; 01-06-2022, 01:45 PM.

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        #18
        Originally posted by Gtkgasman View Post

        We all know by now you loath Horn on the classics.
        Not just on "the classics" for some of us !

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          #19
          Originally posted by RelayerI View Post
          Not just on "the classics" for some of us !
          Horn did sing only classics in 1980!

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            #20
            Originally posted by Ash Armstrong View Post

            The playing of the principals was fine, Downes' technical shortcomings notwithstanding, it was the current material I didn't like, and Horn's vocals were awful. I'm not nor have ever been an admirer of Trevor Horn in any capacity, on whichever side of the studio window he sits.
            While I'm not overfond of the direction they were taking with Tormato, in keeping with the times I suppose, I found Drama almost desperate in its attempt to reinvent the band of the Yes Album/Fragile period, and reinvent the success they'd enjoyed, I'd always hoped they'd look to pursuing the direction set with Relayer, but with Wakeman coming back in that was never going to happen. I had to look elsewhere for that fulfillment, in classical music, avant-garde and mainstream, jazz, dark-wave, and ambient, throughout the 1980s. With the arrival of the music video, rapid returns on investment, short-term impact, corporatisation, image-management and marketing to the fore to name just a few factors, I took refuge from it in other areas.
            When the former-members of Yes became Trevor Rabin's band, and subsequently sought to sell themselves as "Yes", all my perspectives were realised and my take on what was happening confirmed. I'm first and foremost a music lover, not a brand fan. I didn't like the music, so the collective name it adopted was irrelevant to me, and that's still the case now.
            There are any number of authors who have written and published novels under various different names, novels quite different in style and genre and for a different audience, from those they might ordinarily be associated with, and do so in part to distance themselves from those different styles, genre/s and audiences. Quite a few wrote soft-porn...
            That's sort of what happened with various members of Yes for me, only they stuck with the same name. Regrettable. A somewhat similar situation exists now as well, but only as far as I'm concerned. My view of these things, insofar as that's of any consequence, need not trouble anyone else, and I'm not open to persuasion towards a different take on any of it.
            Is it amazing how we agree!πŸ˜‰πŸ˜‰πŸ˜‰πŸ˜‰

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              #21
              Originally posted by Ash Armstrong View Post

              I'm beginning to wish I hadn't shared the photos now....
              I was at that show, and it was grim. Four little words that killed it: And You And I...
              I was standing on the other side, in front of Chris that night. Horn was dire!
              The show I saw was difficult to watch. As you said the principals playing was just fine not withstanding Downes shortcomings.

              Horns voice was shot. And You and I was a catastrophic mess. The crowd unfortunately were upset from the beginning as many did not know Anderson had left. The booing and verbal voice was so bad that Squire started cursing at the people in the 1st few rows.

              I agree they should have called themselves anything but Yes. This marketing screw up was 1 of many and was the beginning of the decline of the 15000 seat full houses Yes was playing to with the exception of the 90125 shows

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                #22
                I went to the 3 nights they played at Newcastle City Hall on that tour and to be honest i thought the shows were dreadful.
                I've seen Yes many times over the years and these were the only shows that that were disappointing.
                As has been mentioned Horns vocals were dire. I think he once said he still has nightmares about going to play maddison Square garden. I to still have nightmares about the shows i seen. I have some photos from that gig , I'll post them if i get time.

                Comment


                  #23
                  Originally posted by Solano View Post
                  I went to the 3 nights they played at Newcastle City Hall on that tour and to be honest i thought the shows were dreadful.
                  I've seen Yes many times over the years and these were the only shows that that were disappointing.
                  As has been mentioned Horns vocals were dire. I think he once said he still has nightmares about going to play maddison Square garden. I to still have nightmares about the shows i seen. I have some photos from that gig , I'll post them if i get time.
                  I'm kind of wondering why, if the first show was already dreadful, you still went to two others. You must like a little masochism πŸ˜‰. I would have sold my tickets to the other two shows or taken my loss on them.

                  The UK tour, judging from bootlegs, was indeed bad. But some of the shows on the US tour were absolutely wonderful. The Boston show, which has a good quality bootleg, comes to mind.

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                    #24
                    I was at the Lewisham show (south London), it was pretty awful. Did Horn sing any notes correctly? I don't think so. Someone called out for Jon Anderson, then someone shouted Wan*er at Horn and I think someone called out for Rick Wakeman when Downes did his solo too. I remember exchanging glances with Squire, he didn't look happy. That night might have been the show that 'broke the Camel's back' so so speak.

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                      #25
                      I wish I'd been able to see the Drama tour, even if Horn did struggle live. Drama is a great album and the songs suit Downes musical ability (which is very different to Wakeman's). Some of the live show, and tour compilation recordings suggest it was more to do with nerves and a long tour than a vocal inability; plus studio work and gigs are different things. Yes, Relayer is the best Yes, along with Topographic, but Drama is awesome too, the final great album for me.

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                        #26
                        Imagine what Drama might have sounded like it Moraz came back and they hired a vocalist who better suited the band. Drama is one of my top Ye ms albums but we could have gotten something very good if that had happened, and without Horn YesWest may have never happened.

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                          #27
                          Originally posted by JMKUSA View Post
                          and without Horn YesWest may have never happened.

                          Win / win, right there !

                          πŸ˜‰

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                            #28
                            Originally posted by JMKUSA View Post
                            without Horn YesWest may have never happened.
                            Oh, if only!

                            Sometimes the lights all shining on me, other times I can barely see.
                            Lately it occurs to me what a long strange trip it’s been.

                            Comment


                              #29
                              Originally posted by Mr. Holland View Post

                              I'm kind of wondering why, if the first show was already dreadful, you still went to two others. You must like a little masochism πŸ˜‰. I would have sold my tickets to the other two shows or taken my loss on them.

                              The UK tour, judging from bootlegs, was indeed bad. But some of the shows on the US tour were absolutely wonderful. The Boston show, which has a good quality bootleg, comes to mind.
                              I'd bought the 3 tickets for the shows in advance and to be fair I quite liked the album. I stuck them out as it was still a chance to appreciate the playing of Squire, Howe and White. To be honest I would have been lucky to have been able to give them tickets away. I might give them msg shows a listen, time might have mellowed my memory a bit.

                              Comment


                                #30
                                Originally posted by Solano View Post

                                I'd bought the 3 tickets for the shows in advance and to be fair I quite liked the album. I stuck them out as it was still a chance to appreciate the playing of Squire, Howe and White. To be honest I would have been lucky to have been able to give them tickets away. I might give them msg shows a listen, time might have mellowed my memory a bit.
                                I also went to all 3 gigs at Newcastle City Hall - by then, I knew what to expect as I had seen the new line up in Birmingham the week before. I enjoyed the shows, albeit that Trevor was already struggling. It was not masochism - I was willing them to do well & I'd managed to get into Drama.

                                One of my overriding memories was, however, somebody trailing a huge Jon Anderson banner over the balcony - made for some awkwardness. Jon was at the City Hall the following week with his New Life band & that was just great.

                                All 4 City Hall concerts were sell outs and great in atmosphere - treasured memories at the strangest times for a devoted Yes fan.

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