Will YES survive the eventual retirement of Alan White and Steve Howe?

[profusion]

I think it's all but certain that the other members of the current Yes besides Howe/White will continue to perform Yes music in concert as a "continuity band" once Steve and Alan hang it up.

Whether they do so as "Yes" is more complicated by the business issues. Remember, Jon Anderson also has an ownership stake in the name. If Howe/White stopped using it while Anderson was still active, it's entirely possible Jon would reclaim the name for a "Yes featuring Jon Anderson" thing.

If none of the three are still active, then it's a murkier question. The Yes name and logo are still valuable intellectual property, and I doubt that Howe/White/Anderson will just give their shares of it away. The other current Yes guys would have to buy the name, undoubtedly, or at least the right to use it for live performance.

The other factor is, as noted, whether the aging fanbase will go for it in large enough numbers to make promoters interested. I'm sure Billy/JD/Geoff/Jay/Guitarist could play bars if they're interested, but anything bigger than that might be a stretch without a '70s legacy member involved. Those guys could probably put together other solo/project gigs that would be more lucrative for them as individual than having to split the Yes proceeds would be.

[PeterCologne]

... Brislin is a talented writer.

Steve's my hero. I feel disloyal and I don't want to put him down, but as a writer, creatively he's not what he was.

I'd still listen to him play any day...

By the way, guitar-wise Steve is my number 1 in the universe as well, and concerning Yes-compositions of course highly important as well for my dearest musical sensation of them all. I just wish he nowadays would lead Yes still with more sense of loooking over the horizon (cooler more edgy singer, more flashy, risky music and not so massively nostalgic, different and cooler cover-art) ... but without expecting wonders. I don't await another Relayer or so.

[Gilly Goodness]

I dunno, Yes carrying on with the newbies would be just a tribute band. Though I think Davison has proved himself as a singer and composer to me. He's smart.
He's connected to rockers old and young. He's flexible. Can write in different company. Same as Sherwood. So they could continue happily.

Or Davison forms a new supergroup with old pal Taylor Hawkins and Billy and Keurzner or whoever. New band. New logo. New direction. Surely Hawkins gets bored with FF.

Be fun to see Downes reunite with Horn for that concept album about robots. Surely it's timely.

Oliver could return. He's proven. Dylan Howe for another familial connection.

The next 10 years will be interesting and after TQ, am not as pessimistic as I once was.


ELECTRIFY EVERYTHING

[bondegezou]

Are you sure, that Haun or Bruhn are at least as good as composers, arrangers, producers and stuff as Steve Howe is now - let alone better? I would be interested in hearing music done by them that is at least as good as Yes' medium-good music?

I'm unfamiliar with Bruhns' work as a composer. Haun co-wrote "The Unknown" on Conspiracy's The Unknown. He's credited as a co-writer of everything on CIRCA:'s first (and possibly second) album, but what he actually contributed is unclear beyond "Haun Solo" on the second album. He's got 5 co-writes on Lodgic's album. He co-wrote, but does not play on, "Dark Sky" on World Trade's second album. He wrote three pieces on Jon Anderson's Sunlight.

Away from music with Yesmen, Haun co-wrote "Don't Tell Me" on Air Supply's The Vanishing Race and 3 songs on Air Supply's The Earth is.... His Soundcloud has examples of his film and TV work: https://soundcloud.com/user-790990285 Here's a short Spotify playlist: https://open.spotify.com/playlist/5b...fggugZppK3rhJ1

[PeterCologne]

I am very much into everything on The Unknown... find most Circa: albums just so so, with exception of the very fine Valley Of The Windmill. I think, Lodgic and World Trade are ok and listenable, not more, not less.

But anyway, what makes such musings really tricky is my experience with Trevor Rabin. Judging from the albums he made before Yes, I never ever would have wanted him to be the successor of a Steve Howe - but when he was, he boosted Yes into its second spring (albeit at the beginning with help from the other Trevor).

[Ash Armstrong]

I am very much into everything on The Unknown... find most Circa: albums just so so, with exception of the very fine Valley Of The Windmill. I think, Lodgic and World Trade are ok and listenable, not more, not less.

But anyway, what makes such musings really tricky is my experience with Trevor Rabin. Judging from the albums he made before Yes, I never ever would have wanted him to be the successor of a Steve Howe - but when he was, he boosted Yes into its second spring (albeit at the beginning with help from the other Trevor).

Arguably, Rabin benefitted as much from his association with Yes as they did from him, if his pre-Yes record is any guide. I saw him in 1980 supporting Steve Hillage. I doubt if anyone thought he was going anywhere at the time. Impossible to say for sure now if the music he was working on prior to hooking up with the remnants of Yes would have been successful, artistically or commercially, or even if it would have been released, had that coming together not have happened.

[PeterCologne]

I saw him in 1980 supporting Steve Hillage...

Envy you. I wanted to see Steve Hillage in 1980 in Cologne. But it was in the days of my highschool, diploma. So I was a good boys and stayed home and studied. Rabin was support act of that show as well. Would have been interesting to have the momory of such an early show with him. Steve Hillage I saw somewhat later, at the end of 2019, with the new Gong opening and then being his band.

[Ash Armstrong]

Envy you. I wanted to see Steve Hillage in 1980 in Cologne. But it was in the days of my highschool, diploma. So I was a good boys and stayed home and studied. Rabin was support act of that show as well. Would have been interesting to have the momory of such an early show with him. Steve Hillage I saw somewhat later, at the end of 2019, with the new Gong opening and then being his band.

Ah, well I missed him in 2019, though I've seen Gong several times in the last few years, and will be doing so again early next year.
I listen to Hillage quite a lot, and there's been some very good live CDs and DVDs released of him in the late 70s.

[PeterCologne]

Ah, well I missed him in 2019, though I've seen Gong several times in the last few years, and will be doing so again early next year.
I listen to Hillage quite a lot, and there's been some very good live CDs and DVDs released of him in the late 70s.

I wait for a Vinyl-relase of his 70s-albums. And the new Gong I found interesting, with a somewhat new drift, more heavy.

[michelforest]

Sometimes, it's better to leave the stage gracefully... When none of the original members/important members (as Steve and Alan are not original members) are gone, what's the point? I really like Tangerine Dream, but the current lineup features none of the original musicians. Why not simply call it something else? Same goes for Yes. A band with Jay Schellen, Jon Davison, Billy Sherwood, Jimmy Haun and Geoff Downes would have no right whatsoever to call itself Yes.

I saw Genesis on Monday night at the Bell Center in Montreal. I had a great time, the setlist was overall very nice, the visuals were, as usual, stunning and the band sounded wonderful... Except Phil, of course, who is a shadow of his former self. Sometimes, it didn't matter: the best moments were the quiet ones. "Follow You Follow Me" as an acoustic number was lovely and moving. "Carpet Crawlers" was great. But on "Domino" and "Home By The Sea", he really struggled. When the guys left the stage, it was clear that I had seen my last Genesis show and that was fine with me, even if I've been listening to that band since 1980. All things must pass, as George sang.

[Laddr]

The pandemic gave me a chance, among other things, to watch a lot of Youtube and of note were the youngsters, teens and 20's, who do classic first time reaction vids. There were a lot of these "kids" who were blown away by Yes and other classic proggers and that music. So, I think the way for current Yes to continue is to play the classics because , IMO, that is the Yesmusic that will live on. The Yes album through Going for the One. It would be great for JD and Billy and company to write some new Yes music of their own, once Steve and Alan retire, and see if it can stand up to the classics. I think the classics are a lightening in a bottle thing but who knows? Also the classics were written in a different time. I think the thing I miss most about no JA in current Yes is that we were robbed of any chance of that particular lightening to ever be caught again. That is Steve and JA cowriting. And of course no thunderous bass. Oh , well.

[downbyariver]

When none of the original members/important members (as Steve and Alan are not original members) are gone, what's the point?

Well, one big benefit, should an ongoing band pursue it, would be to get more new Yes studio albums of original material. Sure, one can argue that a band not called Yes could involve the same people doing the same thing, but the Yes name comes with a greater financial incentive (or at least a lower financial disincentive) for them to all work together. The name also comes with some expectations that would likely encourage most likely future incarnations of the band to go for a configuration of performers, and a style of writing and performance, that exhibits some degree of continuity with the existing Yes catalog. That identity would also be more likely to be persist and less likely to evolve into it's own self-referential thing that was no longer the "Yes without the name" thing it may have begun as an attempt to do.

The Yes name can also be an advantage in terms of pitching things to labels, selling copies of albums, generating media and online buzz, and so on and so forth. It might even help you recruit musicians who would not be interested in playing for either a new band inspired by Yes or a Yes tribute band. It's probably an easier sell to promoters and ticket buyers and would help the band collect more performance fees and open doors to larger venues and/or better financial terms for tours. Being "Yes" carries cache that helps across the board with stuff like that.

Though Circa: isn't an attempt to continue Yes without the name, it has over the years had a lot of current and former Yes members and people associated with the band (Like current and former touring or session musicians) playing classic rock or prog rock. They had trouble touring (Playing limited dates in small venues irregularly) and eventually converted themselves to a studio-only act. If they had been called Yes, I think those struggles to get live gigs would not have existed, and their music would have gotten a lot more attention. I also think that the music would have been done a tad differently- maybe with higher pitch lead singer, among other Yes-isms.

I like Circa: a ton as-is. I don't need it to become Yes. Yes can be Yes and Circa: can be Circa:- and I'll buy albums from both. I also don't care much that Circa: no longer tours- I love their studio albums, and I'm a studio album guy, I'd much rather a band make albums and not tour than tour and not make albums. I just think the idea that the Yes name doesn't carry weight with promoters and influence ticket and album buyers is inaccurate.

Also, for people who've for years been watching Jon Davison, Geoff Downes, Billy Sherwood, and Jay Schellen on stage being Yes, and bought the various live albums and The Quest, how different is it really to buy an album from or go see a concert with all the same guys except for a change on lead guitar and then Alan White no longer making his cameo at the end? If you've been going to concerts every time Yes comes to your area and buying the albums and stuff, you're likely very used to these guys at this point as Yes.

As a fan, there's something special to me about buying and listening to a new Yes album and being able to place it in a continuity of Yes albums.

I actually think there is the potential for the band to get better when the 70s-era guys retire. I'm by no means pushing them out the door, they should keep going as long as they want, they've earned it. I'm just saying, if they are the reason the albums are losing their rock and roll edge and such, and they decide to retire, bringing in younger replacement with a bit more energy and desire to do something a bit louder could be helpful. It also creates new potential writing combinations and chemistry between various performers. Some fans who don't focus as much on the artists as on the music may enjoy the first Yes album with a hypothetical younger cast better than the last Yes album with the classic members- if there is a new Yes album after that.

Yes always kind of been similar to a sports franchise in that the players come and go regularly, but it's still considered the same entity. It already has no original members left, and who is a classic member and so on and so forth is largely a subjective construct created by individual, or groups of, fans. Continuing on if Steve and Alan retire to me would be the most natural thing in the world for a band like Yes- and our favorite band would get to stick around and offer some fans albums they may enjoy..

[bondegezou]

As a fan, there's something special to me about buying and listening to a new Yes album and being able to place it in a continuity of Yes albums.

I actually think there is the potential for the band to get better when the 70s-era guys retire. I'm by no means pushing them out the door, they should keep going as long as they want, they've earned it. I'm just saying, if they are the reason the albums are losing their rock and roll edge and such, and they decide to retire, bringing in younger replacement with a bit more energy and desire to do something a bit louder could be helpful. It also creates new potential writing combinations and chemistry between various performers.

There is another way to get something "with a bit more energy and desire to do something a bit louder", with "new potential writing combinations and chemistry". And that's you coming out of your comfort zone and trying an album that doesn't say "Yes" on the cover!

There's a lot of music out there. I think you're more likely to find something to your exacting tastes by trying new things, maybe exploring what else the musicians you like have done in other contexts, than by waiting for something with the "Yes" name on the cover. Indeed, you like Arc of Life more than The Quest, AIUI, which proves the point.

[profusion]

If Sherwood/Downes/Davison/Schellen/Haun became a "tribute band" after Howe/White retire, playing the classics but not releasing new music as Yes, I see nothing wrong with that.

It's interesting to speculate why none of the Yes tribute bands have ever achieved the touring success of The Musical Box or Dark Star Orchestra. My guess is that the continuing presence of an actual Yes band playing the same repertoire made it less commercially worthwhile to also have a band of unknowns doing that.

Once there is no longer a Yes with classic-era members, then I can demand increase for a tribute band approach. The presence of second- and third-generation Yes members would give them a huge advantage over a bunch of talented unknowns.

The older I get, the more I realize that it's the music that's special and needs to continue. We're all temporary, but the music isn't.

[pianozach]

If Sherwood/Downes/Davison/Schellen/Haun became a "tribute band" after Howe/White retire, playing the classics but not releasing new music as Yes, I see nothing wrong with that.

It's interesting to speculate why none of the Yes tribute bands have ever achieved the touring success of The Musical Box or Dark Star Orchestra. My guess is that the continuing presence of an actual Yes band playing the same repertoire made it less commercially worthwhile to also have a band of unknowns doing that.

Once there is no longer a Yes with classic-era members, then I can demand increase for a tribute band approach. The presence of second- and third-generation Yes members would give them a huge advantage over a bunch of talented unknowns.

The older I get, the more I realize that it's the music that's special and needs to continue. We're all temporary, but the music isn't.

I've only seen one Yes Tribute band live (Closer To The Edge), and they nailed almost every song they played. The beauty was that they didn't play a typical Yes setlist, instead filling the gig with surprise choices, such as Gates of Delerium.