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Q: Steve Howe has no "guitar heir"...Is Yes "done" after Steve's done?

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    Originally posted by True View Post

    Ideally Anderson and Howe would truly rediscover their friendship. For the sake of themselves. I remember the body language during the last few tours with Anderson and Howe, Steve seemed very unhappy on stage. Steve Howe has been much happier-looking on stage since then. So I don't want them to re-unite for the sake of a paycheck. But I could see a situation in which promoters offer better compensation if there could be a tour with both Anderson and Howe. Yes have never done a farewell tour, I'd enjoy seeing some dates which included the current official band plus people like Kaye, Moraz, Benoit, Horn, and of course Anderson, Wakeman and Rabin. I know that will not happen, I'd just like to see it. Just think about the vocal possibilities if every lead singer of the band was on stage. They could do Leave It without tapes. But I'm getting very carried away here!
    Rediscovering their friendship might mean NOT working together anymore, because working together might actually get in the way of friendship .

    Just last month Howe said in an interview:

    "I love Jon Anderson and I believe we have an understanding and an immense respect for each other. But the difficulties of trying to work together are too great."

    Comment


      Originally posted by downbyariver View Post

      One could actually see the first tour or two dictating whether Yes could carry on basically as it has been, has to scale down to doing state fairs and festivals while recording at Billy's studio, packs it in, or anything in between those three scenarios. Promoters will be watching, too- and that's really who determines what options you have for subsequent tours.

      So, I also see the argument for a "safe" pick to make sure things keep going. Haun isn't going to rejuvenate the band, but he also isn't going to fall on his face live. He'd continue to offer a similar experience on stage to what people see today.
      I would be on board with them continuing post-Howe (not that they asked, haha). If we postulate Steve hanging on another five years, well, that time goes by pretty quickly. I would argue that the post-Anderson In the Present tour was a larger risk. They couldn't have known if that would fly long-term or consign them to laughable Ted-Nugent-circuit status.

      Incidentally, Yes was one of the main stage acts at the Wisconsin State Fair in 2013.

      Cheers,
      Mike

      Comment


        Originally posted by bondegezou View Post
        Anyone can play anything they want live.
        For most intents and purposes, yes, but technically, no (at least in the United States).

        Excerpted from: http://www.askamusiclawyer.com/archi...ic-venues.html

        Performing copyrighted songs implicates the copyright owner's exclusive right to publicly perform a work and to authorize others to publicly perform it. Public performances of copyrighted music at live music venues, with limited exceptions, require payment. However, it is generally the responsibility of the venue owner (i.e., the presenter of the public performance), not the performer, to obtain a public performance license and pay any required licensing fees.

        As a practical matter, venue owners obtain blanket licenses from the performing rights organizations (ASCAP, BMI, and SESAC, in the U.S.) to have the right to present musical performances at their venues. That's because it's not feasible for venue owners to research the ownership of each song and negotiate individual public performance licenses. (Imagine the venue owner requiring you to give them your set list weeks in advance and making you promise not to deviate from the list!)
        So, for the most part it's not really a concern for the people playing the cover, and from what I've heard the royalties the original song writers get from live covers that aren't transmitted or recorded are pretty miniscule.
        "A lot of the heavier conversations I was having with Chris toward the end were about his desire for this thing to go forward. He kept reiterating that to me. [...] He kept telling me, 'No matter what happens, Yes needs to continue moving forward and make great music. So promise me that that's something you want to do.'. And I have to keep making music. It's just what I do. [...] I'm a fan of the band and I want to see it thrive and that means new music." -Billy Sherwood

        Comment


          Originally posted by Olorin View Post
          Interesting that there was some sort of legal agreement as far back as 1984. However, I find it ludicrous that if you left the band, you were not allowed to mention you were ever in the band. I mean, I could see some stipulation about not being allowed to say that you were a continuation of the band or were the real band or something like that, but to be forbidden from ever mentioning you were in it? Sheesh. That’s extreme.
          It wasn't, AIUI, that you were banned from mentioning it, but you couldn't use the fact prominently in how you promoted your music. A poster saying "Jon Anderson of YES singing live" was not allowed, but talking about being a member in an interview to promote the tour, sure.

          Comment


            Originally posted by Mr. Holland View Post

            Rediscovering their friendship might mean NOT working together anymore, because working together might actually get in the way of friendship .

            Just last month Howe said in an interview:

            "I love Jon Anderson and I believe we have an understanding and an immense respect for each other. But the difficulties of trying to work together are too great."
            A lot of interesting posts ! But this Howe quote leaves me baffled. Sure, he is in control and really the only (70's) creative force left who now runs everything with no conflicts or Anderson objections or taking control. But, as time is ticking, and as others have said, it would be nice for a final tour or song(s) in light of the Yes message and legacy. At this point they aren't committed to doing multiple albums or tours, just a one off in good will and the spirit of Yes would be nice. That's all. Maybe just 1 freaking big show, or a song before they call it a day ! How difficult would that be without getting kicked in the head? Ah never mind.... I'm just looking for a happy ending and something I can enjoy from my favorite band. The Quest and current live band isn't it, I'm not feeling it at all.... But they don't owe me anything, I'm grateful for so much awesome music and live stuff I still love from 2014 and before.... Just a thought- But something tells me Howe and Anderson won't be calling it a day, they are going to keep rocking until they can't.
            Last edited by Somis Sound; 06-22-2022, 02:49 PM.

            Comment


              Originally posted by Somis Sound View Post

              A lot of interesting posts ! But this Howe quote leaves me baffled. Sure, he is in control and really the only (70's) creative force left who now runs everything with no conflicts or Anderson objections or taking control. But, as time is ticking, and as others have said, it would be nice for a final tour or song(s) in light of the Yes message and legacy. At this point they aren't committed to doing multiple albums or tours, just a one off in good will and the spirit of Yes would be nice. That's all. Maybe just 1 freaking big show, or a song before they call it a day ! How difficult would that be without getting kicked in the head? Ah never mind.... I'm just looking for a happy ending and something I can enjoy from my favorite band. The Quest and current live band isn't it, I'm not feeling it at all.... But they don't owe me anything, I'm grateful for so much awesome music and live stuff I still love from 2014 and before.... Just a thought- But something tells me Howe and Anderson won't be calling it a day, they are going to keep rocking until they can't.
              I think the 2004 tour was really the big send off so to speak. The big party. I am glad that things have continued in different iterations and all, but in hindsight, I view the 35th anniversary tour as the send off for Yes with a capital Y. Heck, some might even say that the Union tour was that. Make no mistake, I do like the post Anderson albums, and will continue to support them, but it has been a different animal since 2004 is all I mean.

              For me, with Squire and White gone, there is not much joy in a reunion. Howe and Anderson are still only part of the puzzle, and two of the other pieces are gone forever now. A new song or show would be cool and all, but it would feel no more “complete” to me than ARW or Yes O as it stands.

              Comment


                Originally posted by Chrisklenox View Post

                I think the 2004 tour was really the big send off so to speak. The big party. I am glad that things have continued in different iterations and all, but in hindsight, I view the 35th anniversary tour as the send off for Yes with a capital Y. Heck, some might even say that the Union tour was that. Make no mistake, I do like the post Anderson albums, and will continue to support them, but it has been a different animal since 2004 is all I mean.

                For me, with Squire and White gone, there is not much joy in a reunion. Howe and Anderson are still only part of the puzzle, and two of the other pieces are gone forever now. A new song or show would be cool and all, but it would feel no more “complete” to me than ARW or Yes O as it stands.
                I have to agree.... Well said.

                Comment


                  I feel like Yes has been doing reunions of various sorts ever since Rick Wakeman reunited with the band in 1977, Jon Anderson and Tony Kaye in 1983, the entire 70s and 80s lineups minus Trevor Horn, Geoff Downes, and Peter Banks in 1991, YesWest in 1994, a take on a fan favorite 70s Yes lineup in 1996 and again in 2004, Downes and Horn (kind of) in 2011, Sherwood in 2015, Kaye, Moraz, and Brislin in 2018, etc.. There was also the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame performance featuring 5 of the 8 inducted members.

                  Keys to Ascension's live half was explicitly kind of an effort to get some of the main guys on tape 20 years later doing some of their 70s songs live with more modern technology.

                  Howe added some remote guitar work to a song from a recent Anderson album.

                  Various current and former members of Yes (Though not Anderson or Howe) were on Prog Collective (self-titled), and Prog Collective Epilogue, as well as on Billy Sherwood's solo Citizen album.

                  At some point, one wonders just how many reunions people should feel obligated to do with folks who they've spent a lot of their lives essentially living with (on the road) and not getting along with. I mean, a lot of adult children become estranged from their parents (or just relatives becoming estranged from relatives in general) because they reach a point where they say "How many more decades am I supposed to tolerate this behavior from them messing up my life and adding to my unhappiness?". People freely find and choose spouses, and voluntarily choose to be with them until death do them part, but it's not considered at all weird for them to later divorce and avoid each other. Band mates are just coworkers who have a lot less social obligation to each other than relatives or spouses, with no ties of blood or marital type unions (Sometimes you just join a band by answering an ad in the back of a newspaper and having a 30 minute tryout), but sometimes spend just as much time with each other and have this huge joint venture to fight about, and for some reason are sometimes expected by some fans to stay together forever or engage in a neverending series of reunions until death do them part even if they've spent decades together already and all they do is fight and make each other miserable.

                  Apart from the human angle, I also don't really fully see what people expect to get out of forcing Jon and Steve together. A lot of the guys one might expect in a classic lineup reunion have passed away or retired. Some of the guys who've been involved in Yes for a while who are still alive and playing music professionally might have no interest or be vetoed by one party or the other (Examples: Anderson, Rabin, and Wakeman each individually vetoed having Sherwood play at the HOF induction. There seems to be some friction between Howe and Rabin. Anderson has vetoed having Downes in Yes in the past and Downes has criticized Anderson online. Etc.).

                  I also wonder if it'd really be fulfilling for audiences to see people who don't want to be around each other charge big bucks to play a carefully negotiated set of classic songs for the umteenth time, each time progressively worse than their last, while all new music and hopes of a long-term continuing Yes are put on the back burner indefinitely.

                  I'd rather see a band that focuses on creating new Yes music and getting younger and not older to deliver more rock and roll energy to performances of existing songs and to the creation of new ones. It was neat when Yes brought out Tony Kaye for encores in 2018, and if Anderson were willing to do something like that at a low cost and pass the torch, that'd be cool, but it isn't going to happen.

                  I know that Jon Anderson and Jon Davison talking about making new music together some years ago wasn't a serious thing, but I'd be much more interested in hearing that album than in Steve and Jon touring the world and trying not to kill each other.

                  Everyone just make new albums. . Especially official new Yes albums!
                  Last edited by downbyariver; 06-23-2022, 09:26 PM.
                  "A lot of the heavier conversations I was having with Chris toward the end were about his desire for this thing to go forward. He kept reiterating that to me. [...] He kept telling me, 'No matter what happens, Yes needs to continue moving forward and make great music. So promise me that that's something you want to do.'. And I have to keep making music. It's just what I do. [...] I'm a fan of the band and I want to see it thrive and that means new music." -Billy Sherwood

                  Comment


                    Originally posted by Somis Sound View Post
                    But this Howe quote leaves me baffled. Sure, he is in control and really the only (70's) creative force left who now runs everything with no conflicts or Anderson objections or taking control. But, as time is ticking, and as others have said, it would be nice for a final tour or song(s) in light of the Yes message and legacy. At this point they aren't committed to doing multiple albums or tours, just a one off in good will and the spirit of Yes would be nice. That's all. Maybe just 1 freaking big show, or a song before they call it a day ! How difficult would that be without getting kicked in the head?
                    Their last reunion as Yes, at the Rock 'n' Roll Hall of Fame, appears to have been painful and difficult with arguments over the line-up.

                    More generally, note my phrase there at the beginning of that last sentence: "their last reunion". They keep doing reunions. There was the song together on Jon's 1000 Hands, there was the Hall of Fame, there was the 2002 reunion, there was San Luis Obispo, there was the Union album, there was ABWH before that. If we don't specify Howe and Anderson being together, there have been further reunions: in 2008, and then with ARW. For nearly as long as I have been a Yes fan, other fans have said they wanted a final tour or song(s) back together... and then a "classic" line-up reunited for a period, and within a few months of that latest reunion ending, the same calls would return. Can we have just one (more) final tour or song(s)?

                    If Howe and Anderson did a show together, within 6 months, people would be asking for a final, final tour before they call it a day.

                    Comment


                      Originally posted by downbyariver View Post
                      Everyone just make new albums. . Especially new Yes official albums!
                      I agree with much of what you said, dbar.

                      For me, "Yes" is still about the future, not just the past. By that, I mean I am excited in the new music that Howe, Anderson, Downes, Rabin, Sherwood, Horn, Davison etc. are making. I look forward to the new Yes album, and the new DBA album, and hopefully, eventually, that new Trevor Rabin solo album. I look forward to Horn's Eighties Chill project, to the second Arc of Life, to hearing a John Lodge solo project with Downes and Davison, to a new Kansas album with Brislin contributing. I am enjoying the stream of Jon Anderson recordings on social media (even if I wish he'd package them up and put them on Bandcamp). I am enjoying Brad Mehldau's Jacob's Ladder.

                      Comment


                        Originally posted by bondegezou View Post

                        I am enjoying Brad Mehldau's Jacob's Ladder.
                        Just as a slight sidebar life is short and there is a lot of music out there. I listen to lots of music that I like but never return to but this Brad Mehldau release is one I keep returning to again and again.

                        Comment


                          Me personally, I would not want a 'final tour' or an overhyped 'reunion', as it places an expiration date on Yes. I would want Yes to continue whether it was a classic Yes with Anderson Howe and Wakeman with Sherwood and Schellen subbing for their departed musical comrades, or a future Yes where Jay Schellen was the last guy left out of the Quest era on a new album with all new personnel adhering to the Yes mission statement, whatever that was.

                          Other than that, there's tons of releases coming out of the Yes Cinematic Universe brand, like the ones mentioned above. I look forward to these. As for forcing Anderson & Howe together to 'come up with more of the magic', it's possible that to maintain a level of friendship they choose not to work together so they don't jeopardize their good will for each other. It's possible to like someone as long as you don't work with them. That happens a lot in music. Genesis for example - still good friends with Peter Gabriel, though any sort of reunion with him in unlikely - apparently they like each other as people with shared history, but they may not be too keen on jumping into the fire again together. Not counting a one off reunion in 1982 and doing documentaries and reissues together and stuff, the last time they worked closely together was The Lamb Lies Down On Broadway almost 50 years ago, and it was a lousy experience for them. I guess it's like that for Jon Anderson & Steve Howe - just leave it in the past and get on with the music.

                          I'm in it for new music from whatever incarnation, bring on the next ten Yes albums!
                          Last edited by Soundwaveseeker; 06-23-2022, 05:35 AM.

                          Comment


                            Originally posted by agentarmstrong View Post
                            Just thinking about Alan today. Just kind of heavy... both what he means to YES (a hell of a lot), and what "YES" means with one member left from the 1970s.

                            The band had an "heir apparent" for both Chris Squire / bass, AND drums with Jay Schellen.

                            But what happens after Steve's done? What does / can YES actually "mean" in the 2020s and beyond...when NO members in the band are left from the halcyon days of YES in the 1970s...???


                            -Douglas
                            I don't know about you all, but I've been playing AIR guitar to Steve Howe for years. hmmm.... never mind.

                            Comment


                              Originally posted by bondegezou View Post

                              Their last reunion as Yes, at the Rock 'n' Roll Hall of Fame, appears to have been painful and difficult with arguments over the line-up.

                              More generally, note my phrase there at the beginning of that last sentence: "their last reunion". They keep doing reunions. There was the song together on Jon's 1000 Hands, there was the Hall of Fame, there was the 2002 reunion, there was San Luis Obispo, there was the Union album, there was ABWH before that. If we don't specify Howe and Anderson being together, there have been further reunions: in 2008, and then with ARW. For nearly as long as I have been a Yes fan, other fans have said they wanted a final tour or song(s) back together... and then a "classic" line-up reunited for a period, and within a few months of that latest reunion ending, the same calls would return. Can we have just one (more) final tour or song(s)?

                              If Howe and Anderson did a show together, within 6 months, people would be asking for a final, final tour before they call it a day.
                              Haha. Good points Henry. I agree. For me, 2004 Lugano is my favorite final reunion farewell with my favorite guys... I was just having one of those one more reunion moments
                              Last edited by Somis Sound; 06-23-2022, 02:47 PM.

                              Comment


                                If asked, I would certainly audition for it.

                                Howe is one of the sole reasons I've never stopped playing guitars. Because if you stop practicing the guitar you won't be able to continue playing Yes music on that guitar!

                                I would need to buy another console steel guitar for AYAI.

                                We can all dream.

                                Can't we?


                                Comment

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