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2000-2008: What Went WRONG For "Classic YES"?

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    Originally posted by Somis Sound View Post

    Yes, you were 100% wrong about Jon's illness and your insinuating it was some sort of conspiracy or excuse was just bizarre. It was sad how sick he got, but it was also sad how he had treated his bandmates building up to his sickness.

    The fact is, Jon held the band hostage over his unfair demands of the pie and his dictating they would not go in the studio but just play new music live and record that. The band wanted to do an album for years and possibly get Horn to produce. You add all that up and I don't blame them for looking for a new singer. Chris was truly hurt by all that. I don't blame him. And sure the CTTEAB Tour had to be resized down to smaller venues in some markets. But the same venue on that cancelled tour was rebooked in LA with Benoit! I was there........ But hey, believe what you want to.
    You mislead by saying the Close and Back Tour was rebooked. It was not. You are spinning the truth. The Close and Back Tour was cancelled. Period! In almost every market they went from a 12000 seat venue to a theatre. And it was not called Close to the Edge and Back..

    As far as Jon and his treatment of his band mates he was done with Yes after 20004. They begged him to return for the 40th tour and Jon's management said this is what he wants. Take it or leave it!. Squire and Yes said OK and it busted out with tickets not selling because the economy and stock market collapsed. And that was that! Anderson never sung with Yes again..

    Jon Anderson did not owe his bandmates anything. Yes toured and toured and toured.. Anderson was not responsible if a bandmate did not manage their lives right and had to keep touring touring touring the same songs over and over and over again as the fan base dwindled to 1500 per show on average.
    .

    This oh my Jon was sick and he was wrapped in a blanket after his solo show.. This oh my he had respiratory failure.. This oh my he had to be resuscitated. This oh he had an asthma attack. This he was lying in a bed in a coma..

    Many different stories!. What we know for a fact is the Close and Back show was canceled because tickets did not sell and it was going to be a financial disaster. Squire did not wait several months to see how Anderson was doing. He immediately within a few weeks hired Benoit and 3 months after the Close and Back Tour was to start they did the Benoit tour.

    What we also know is 14 years later Anderson at 76 years old is able to do 14 shows in a month knocking them dead with quality shows. And he never appears to have anything more than a sniffle here and a sneeze there and a sinus cleanup in the last 14 years.

    Comment


      Originally posted by Davy View Post
      From a selfish go-to-shows perspective, I'm glad HSW carried on, even if it really was a new band. I've enjoyed the newer albums more than most of their '90s records.
      As Howe said, the current unit gets on, and can do the work. It works. It's not as good as having Jon, and certainly not as good as having Chris, but what is? The current lot play a lot of gigs and tours reaching a lot of people, I suppose you have to weight that between the other option, which was maybe one large concert with Jon at wembley or something every three years or so, where you can only get ticket at the back. I'm not saying which one is better, mind, it's just how it is. If you ask me to choose, i'd choose both, of course

      Comment


        Let me add touring is hard. It is especially hard as you get older. Constant travel! Different hotels! Bad hotel food. Different weather conditions. It is hard unless you are a U2 and you can travel in a private plane and can play 18000 sellout stadiums once every 6 days.

        Singers and bandmates get sick. Just like a construction worker or a plumber. I saw Peter Cetera right before the covid. He was great. But now he is retired. Why? The travel, hotels, etc.

        This oh poor Jon. Sick wrapped in a blanket oh my oh my oh my. Goodness! The man is knocking them dead singing great at almost 77 putting out new music. Doing it 14 years after respiratory failure, in a coma, having to be resuscitated exactly at the same time the Close and Back tour was busting out and being cancelled.

        This is More More More Drama. Where is Horn when you need him?

        Comment


          Originally posted by alex peters View Post

          Well thank you for the lecture. I think you should look in the mirror on the nutter and rude comment. I did not call you a nutter. You calling me a nutter is abusive.. My opinions are strong on many issues. I do not back down until the facts prove me otherwise. Unlike many I will admit I am wrong at times.

          No, what you see with you in all due respect and the LEFT is general is Intolerance towards others who have opinions that are contrary to yours. Shut them down! Ban them! Censorship with a capital C. It does not matter whether it is the controversial 2008 Close to Back tour or a political subject.

          You need to relax. I am not worked up about anything. My life is great and wonderful.. Your lectures do not bother me. I want everyone to be happy. Mr. Ash and others cannot stand me but I enjoy his posts on cooking etc.

          Why don't you and others chill out. If you see a post you disagree with rebute it with facts facts facts. Ultimately everyone must sometime agree to disagree and be happy.

          The 2008 debacle has been avoided like the plague. No one mentions it until I did but it is history and the end of Yes as we knew them. But the truth is that tour was canceled because tickets did not sell. For a band that sold out football stadiums during the Relayer tour it was a shocking fall
          So basically everyone else has to rebute with facts, facts, facts, while you can just spout all sorts of unsubstantiated thoughts about Jon's illnes and cast an unsubstantiated shadow of doubt on whether it was all that serious and not half made up as an excuse for a cancelled tour. Does the saying "what's good for the goose is good for the gander" ring a bell?

          Comment


            Originally posted by Somis Sound View Post

            But the same venue on that cancelled tour was rebooked in LA with Benoit! I was there........ But hey, believe what you want to.
            Sorry. You are mistaken. But time does blur all our memories

            Comment


              Originally posted by Mr. Holland View Post

              So basically everyone else has to rebute with facts, facts, facts, while you can just spout all sorts of unsubstantiated thoughts about Jon's illnes and cast an unsubstantiated shadow of doubt on whether it was all that serious and not half made up as an excuse for a cancelled tour. Does the saying "what's good for the goose is good for the gander" ring a bell?
              I love that saying. " What's good for the goose is good for the gander". Yes. You make an excellent point.


              The reason for the 2008 show cancelation was horrible ticket sales. That is a fact.

              Jon's illness is speculation. How bad it was? What exactly it was. The lack of information that came out at the time and then when you did get information months later it was contradictory and not from the horses mouth.. I fully admit it.

              I do not believe in conspiracies but I do not believe in coincidences also..

              In September 2008 Anderson angrily gives an interview with NME complaining about YES moving on and not waiting until 2009 and his recovery. He says only Alan White called him with 1 phone call. The article states he had acute respiratory failure.

              Well, did the band not believe his illness. Did the band realize his contract demands were never going to work anymore with the fanbase Yes had because the Close and Back Tour did not sell? Why not at least a phone call from Howe and Squire?

              One thing you never get from these guys after 1980 is the straight truth.

              Comment


                It wasn't just respiratory issues, Anderson had other health problems as well.

                Comment


                  Originally posted by Davy View Post
                  It wasn't just respiratory issues, Anderson had other health problems as well.
                  And today at 77 he does 14 dates with the kids in a month knocking them dead.

                  Comment


                    Originally posted by Davy View Post
                    It wasn't just respiratory issues, Anderson had other health problems as well.

                    The 2008 tour was just over a month away from starting. Rehearsals were about to begin with a new keys player. The band as a whole had not played together in 4 years

                    And then just at that moment right before rehearsals Anderson has the greatest health crisis of his lifetime. Some say asthma. Some say respiratory failure. Some say he was dead and resuscitated. Some say pancreatitis. Some say all of the above.

                    Do you know what the odds of that happening at that moment? 1 in 10,000 .

                    Alot of $ had been spent leading up to this huge production. If there was no insurance policy for the cancellation someone was going to lose alot of pesos.

                    There are no conspiracies theories and there are no coincidences.
                    Last edited by alex peters; 09-22-2022, 12:42 PM.

                    Comment


                      Originally posted by alex peters View Post


                      The 2008 tour was just over a month away from starting. Rehearsals were about to begin with a new keys player. The band as a whole had not played together in 4 years

                      And then just at that moment right before rehearsals Anderson has the greatest health crisis of his lifetime. Some say asthma. Some say respiratory failure. Some say he was dead and resuscitated. Some say pancreatitis. Some say all of the above.

                      Do you know what the odds of that happening at that moment? 1 in 10,000 .

                      Alot of $ had been spent leading up to this huge production. If there was no insurance policy for the cancellation someone was going to lose alot of pesos.

                      There are no conspiracies theories and there are no coincidences.
                      Just more repeated unsubstantiated speculation about Jon's illnes and more casting an unsubstantiated shadow of doubt on whether it was all that serious and not half made up as an excuse for a cancelled tour.

                      I do remember by the way that a couple of days prior to his asthma attack, Jon did a phone interview with some radio show, promoting the tour, and he sounded very hoarse and was coughing an awful lot and quite a few people on the old site where wondering out loud how in that condition he was going to do the tour.

                      Comment


                        Originally posted by Mr. Holland View Post

                        Just more repeated unsubstantiated speculation about Jon's illnes and more casting an unsubstantiated shadow of doubt on whether it was all that serious and not half made up as an excuse for a cancelled tour.

                        I do remember by the way that a couple of days prior to his asthma attack, Jon did a phone interview with some radio show, promoting the tour, and he sounded very hoarse and was coughing an awful lot and quite a few people on the old site where wondering out loud how in that condition he was going to do the tour.
                        No. Just repeating all the reports from various sources. If he was hoarse and coughing and sick why was he doing the radio show? He should have been in bed and Squire does the radio show

                        Comment


                          Would be nice to go back and look at some of the old posts/threads from yesfans.com.
                          People like money. Jon was probably hoping he would recover for the tour. However, earlier in the day he did announce the tour on the radio for the first time. I may have heard the announcement/ interview much later. However, I was in Philly to see Jon that evening where he announced the tour for the second time. He was far too sick to be on stage, and, again, frankly too sickly, as a person who has studied tens of thousands of people, and not a doctor, to even be discussing a tour; yet I still bought a few tickets, anyway.

                          My timeline is slightly vague, but Jon either went to the hospital the day after Philly show, or two days later for the first time in this juncture. Then about four days later, I believe it was reported he spent three or four days in the hospital. Sometime after he had surgery in California . Henry probably has a list of things done to Jon over the years, surgery wise.
                          Jon was lucky to be alive. Yes, I heard about a resuscitation as well. He was housebound and weak for a very long time. Yes, he did some work over the Internet, with different musicians who were happy to work with Jon, and share those works. Jon sounded old, frail and extremely weak. Painful to listen to. I thought the days of Jon touring were over. Somehow he did some solo shows and a tour with Rick where I never saw him play guitar so well. At his age, his voice will never be what it was; but it is amazing still. Yes, poor ticket sales may have played a part, but Jon was extremely ill, hospitalized twice during a short period of time during his solo tour just after the announcement of the tour, and surgery shortly after back in California. There were a couple of videos put out by one of Jon's daughters that weren't up long.

                          I know when folks are sick, esp. when I've been watching them for years in the front rows of all kinds of venues. I also know when people are healthy.

                          ​​​
                          Last edited by luvyesmusic; 09-22-2022, 06:19 PM.

                          Comment


                            Originally posted by luvyesmusic View Post
                            Would be nice to go back and look at some of the old posts/threads from yesfans.com.
                            People like money. Jon was probably hoping he would recover for the tour. However, earlier in the day he did announce the tour on the radio for the first time. I may have heard the announcement/ interview much later. However, I was in Philly to see Jon that evening where he announced the tour for the second time. He was far too sick , to healthy to be on stage, and, again, frankly too sickly, as a person who has studied tens of thousands of people, and not a doctor, to even be discussing a tour; yet I still bought a few tickets, anyway

                            My timeline is slightly vague, but Jon either went to the hospital the day after Philly show, or two days later for the first time in this juncture. Then about four days later, I believe it was reported he spent three or four days in the hospital. Sometime after he had surgery in California . Henry probably has a list of things done to Jon over the years, surgery wise.
                            Jon was lucky to be alive. Yes, I heard about a resuscitation as well. He was housebound and weak for a very long time. Yes, he did some work over the Internet, with different musicians who were happy to work with Jon, and share those works. Jon sounded old, frail and extremely weak. Painful to listen to. I thought the days of Jon touring were over. Somehow he did some solo shows and a tour with Rick where I never saw him play guitar so well. At his age, his voice will never be what it was; but it is amazing still. Yes, poor ticket sales may have played a part, but Jon was extremely ill, hospitalized twice during a short period of time during his solo tour just after the announcement of the tour, and surgery shortly after back in California. There were a couple of videos put out by one of Jon's daughters that weren't up long.

                            I know when folks are sick, esp. when I've been watching them for years in the front rows of all kinds of venues. I also know when people are healthy.

                            ​​​
                            Your are great Luvyesmusic but Jon did 3 more shows in the next 5 days after the Philly show. And several weeks later in April 8 ,9 and 10 he did 3 shows in California at 3 different locations.

                            You are mistaken
                            Last edited by alex peters; 09-22-2022, 06:53 PM.

                            Comment


                              Originally posted by alex peters View Post


                              The 2008 tour was just over a month away from starting. Rehearsals were about to begin with a new keys player. The band as a whole had not played together in 4 years

                              And then just at that moment right before rehearsals Anderson has the greatest health crisis of his lifetime. Some say asthma. Some say respiratory failure. Some say he was dead and resuscitated. Some say pancreatitis. Some say all of the above.

                              Do you know what the odds of that happening at that moment? 1 in 10,000 .


                              Alot of $ had been spent leading up to this huge production. If there was no insurance policy for the cancellation someone was going to lose alot of pesos.

                              There are no conspiracies theories and there are no coincidences.
                              YOU are mistaken. And YOU are making a conspiracy theory just right here above in your post. Look dude, I spent a lot of time with Deborah at the time, and spent some time with Squire and White on a few different occasions. I can tell you 100% fact is that Jon did come off stage with a blanket at a solo show right before he got even worse, that he was in a hospital, that he did die for a few minutes and was resuscitated, it was no stunt to get out of the tour, that the other guys did NOT agree to his demands for the CTTEABT, and there was extreme bad vibes and relations. They had meetings with someone during the "negotiations" on Jon's demand, to replace him then! Or to put a fire under his feet and get back down to Earth on his demands. This DID happen and it was renegotiated after said events when he came to his senses and heard what was going on. Also I did see Beniot at the SAME location the CTTEABT was booked on the ITP Tour. YOU are mistaken, again. And it is a big venue... Here is the link:
                              http://forgotten-yesterdays.com/index.asp

                              You are correct the CTTEABT didn't sell many tickets and was most likely going to be re-booked and rescheduled, but all this other conspiracy theory and claims is just bizarre. Take a deep breath and pop on your favorite Yes album and let it go dude...
                              Last edited by Somis Sound; 09-23-2022, 04:51 PM.

                              Comment


                                Originally posted by Somis Sound View Post

                                YOU are mistaken. And YOU are making a conspiracy theory just right here above in your post. Look dude, I spent a lot of time with Deborah at the time, and spent some time with Squire and White on a few different occasions. I can tell you 100% fact is that Jon did come off stage with a blanket at a solo show right before he got even worse, that he was in a hospital, that he did die for a few minutes and was resuscitated, it was no stunt to get out of the tour, that the other guys did NOT agree to his demands for the CTTEABT, and there was extreme bad vibes and relations. They had meetings with someone during the "negotiations" on Jon's demand, to replace him then! Or to put a fire under his feet and get back down to Earth on his demands. This DID happen and it was renegotiated after said events when he came to his senses and heard what was going on. Also I did see Beniot at the SAME location the CTTEABT was booked on the ITP Tour. YOU are mistaken, again. And it is a big venue... Here is the link:
                                http://forgotten-yesterdays.com/index.asp

                                You are correct the CTTEABT didn't sell many tickets and was most likely going to be re-booked and rescheduled, but all this other conspiracy theory and claims is just bizarre. Take a deep breath and pop on your favorite Yes album and let it go dude...
                                Relax Mr. Somis Sound. MR. luvyesmusic said Anderson went into the hospital for 3 or 4 days after the Philly show. I said he was mistaken as Jon did 3 shows in the next 5 days after the Philly show and then another show that month in March and then 3 days in a row on April 8, 9, and 10 in California in 3 different cities .

                                He was mistaken. The post you reference is basically all factual.. No conspiracy theory.. Just alot of coincidence


                                The rest of what you are saying is all hearsay hearsay hearsay
                                Last edited by alex peters; 09-23-2022, 06:02 PM.

                                Comment

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