Jay’s future with Yes

[Frumious B]

A good source told me Sherwood did do session work on Talk.

There's no Haun on "The More We Live". Haun was working with the ABWH side, not the YesWest side.

I don’t have access to the sources you do, but I have a hard time thinking this is the case for several reasons:

1. I asked Billy Sherwood directly and he said he’s not on the record.
2. Nearly all of the album was played live with Squire as the primary bassist and it didn’t seem like he was having any difficulty with the material at all or was unfamiliar with it. I know you can practice and learn these things, but if Squire was in such a bad way that the band had Sherwood ready to go as a backup for the tour then do you think Squire would have been in good enough shape to learn an album’s worth of new bass parts originally played by Sherwood?
3. I think that Sherwood ghosting Squire would have made more of an effort to put more classic Squire trademarks into the record both because he was a superfan and it would have been his job to make people think his playing was Squire, much like it was Jimmy Haun’s job to sound like Steve Howe on Union.
4. Trevor Rabin was all ready producing, singing, playing guitar, keyboards and co-writing the album. If he needed a little more bass here or there to fill in any gaps left by Squire he could have done it himself very easily.

[downbyariver]

A good source told me Sherwood did do session work on Talk.

That's interesting. Someone should ask Sherwood about it in an interview. It's been over 30 years, he might be willing to admit to it now even if it was hush-hush at the time.

Any idea if this session work was specifically filling in for a potentially unavailable or under-available Chris Squire on bass during some of the Talk studio sessions, for the same reasons the band feared Squire might not be able to do the tour promoting the album release, or if it was just general typical session work (Potentially on a various instruments, a different instrument, and/or vocal harmonies)?

There's no Haun on "The More We Live". Haun was working with the ABWH side, not the YesWest side.

I suppose I tend to think of "The More We Live" as separate from the YesWest portion of the album because it wasn't one of Trevor Rabin's demos. However, that still means you're correct and Jimmy Haun didn't play on it. I knew I should have looked that one up first. Union is still pretty confusing. I tend to like the finished product a little best than most, though.

[Frumious B]

That's interesting. Someone should ask Sherwood about it in an interview. It's been over 30 years, he might be willing to admit to it now even if it was hush-hush at the time.

Any idea if this session work was specifically filling in for a potentially unavailable or under-available Chris Squire on bass during some of the Talk studio sessions, for the same reasons the band feared Squire might not be able to do the tour promoting the album release, or if it was just general typical session work (Potentially on a various instruments, a different instrument, and/or vocal harmonies)?



I suppose I tend to think of "The More We Live" as separate from the YesWest portion of the album because it wasn't one of Trevor Rabin's demos. However, that still means you're correct and Jimmy Haun didn't play on it. I knew I should have looked that one up first. Union is still pretty confusing. I tend to like the finished product a little best than most, though.

It wasn’t an interview, but I posed the question to him directly a few years ago and his answer was an unambiguous and unequivocal “no”.

[luna65]

A good source told me Sherwood did do session work on Talk.

Did you get specifics? I mean, officially it was always "no he didn't" but I can see them making a pact to cover up potential holes in the process, as it were.

[Homemade Parachute]

Did you get specifics? I mean, officially it was always "no he didn't" but I can see them making a pact to cover up potential holes in the process, as it were.

Not to get all lawyerly (which I'm not, other than, you know, being a parent of snarky teenagers), but "Sherwood *did* do session work on Talk" and "Sherwood does *not* appear on the album" may not be mutually exclusive, if "session work" indeed means rehearsals, rough mixes/demos, etc etc, but material that is ultimately not used… I mean until Talk: Return Trip shows up, say…

[Davy]

Some of the bass work is probably Trevor. Even Chris on one of the documentaries said he's not sure how much of his playing is on it, although he may have been referring to the way some of the music was changed via the computer.

[Somis Sound]

Some of the bass work is probably Trevor. Even Chris on one of the documentaries said he's not sure how much of his playing is on it, although he may have been referring to the way some of the music was changed via the computer.

Yep. He said much like BG, he and Alan had finished their work on the album much earlier. Trevor spent the bulk of the time on guitars, keys, editing, overdubbing, vocals, and mixing. And Chris did mention in some parts of Talk it was so manipulated and edited, he couldn't tell if it was him anymore. As Frum mentioned, if Trevor wanted to change a bass line, he certainly did. As well as added drum samples and editing all over the place. Listen to the live I Am Waiting, it is a bit different of a bass line than the album. But songs like Real Love or The Calling are spot on. The Talk live dvd is soooo good

[rabin105]

Not to get all lawyerly (which I'm not, other than, you know, being a parent of snarky teenagers), but "Sherwood *did* do session work on Talk" and "Sherwood does *not* appear on the album" may not be mutually exclusive, if "session work" indeed means rehearsals, rough mixes/demos, etc etc, but material that is ultimately not used… I mean until Talk: Return Trip shows up, say…

Stop giving Trevor Horn ideas I still have night mares about fly from here return trip

[Progify]

That's interesting. Someone should ask Sherwood about it in an interview. It's been over 30 years, he might be willing to admit to it now even if it was hush-hush at the time.

Over 30 years?

[downbyariver]

Over 30 years?

Alright, Talk was released in 1994, so 28 years. For some reason I was basing my mental math on Union.

I'm glad there isn't some sort of forum wide accuracy rating by poster, because my performance on this thread would really be zeroing me out right now.

[luna65]

"Sherwood *did* do session work on Talk" and "Sherwood does *not* appear on the album" may not be mutually exclusive

Yes I DO understand such a concept. I was asking if there was specifics either way.

[bondegezou]

I don’t have access to the sources you do, but I have a hard time thinking this is the case for several reasons:

1. I asked Billy Sherwood directly and he said he’s not on the record.
2. Nearly all of the album was played live with Squire as the primary bassist and it didn’t seem like he was having any difficulty with the material at all or was unfamiliar with it. I know you can practice and learn these things, but if Squire was in such a bad way that the band had Sherwood ready to go as a backup for the tour then do you think Squire would have been in good enough shape to learn an album’s worth of new bass parts originally played by Sherwood?
3. I think that Sherwood ghosting Squire would have made more of an effort to put more classic Squire trademarks into the record both because he was a superfan and it would have been his job to make people think his playing was Squire, much like it was Jimmy Haun’s job to sound like Steve Howe on Union.
4. Trevor Rabin was all ready producing, singing, playing guitar, keyboards and co-writing the album. If he needed a little more bass here or there to fill in any gaps left by Squire he could have done it himself very easily.

I note your points. What can I say? I don't know the answer. I know a good source told me Sherwood played bass and drums on Talk. That may well be wrong, or it might be right.

As for (4), I note that Rabin doesn't drum on his own work.

[bondegezou]

Did you get specifics? I mean, officially it was always "no he didn't" but I can see them making a pact to cover up potential holes in the process, as it were.

3/4 of the bass and 1/2 the drums is what I was told. I don't know how accurate this was. It could be a misunderstanding somewhere. Sherwood has denied it.

[Homemade Parachute]

Yes I DO understand such a concept. I was asking if there was specifics either way.

I wish I knew too, but Yes can be such a cagey band about some things, esp. after Union, eh? One day there will be a great documentary about the history of the band, Yeshōmon…

[Progify]

3/4 of the bass and 1/2 the drums is what I was told. I don't know how accurate this was. It could be a misunderstanding somewhere. Sherwood has denied it.

I don’t hear any drums on Talk that sound like his usual tripping over the kit rhythmic stylings.