ronsalehnasir
08-30-2002, 06:00 PM
Interpretations are not exactly right or wrong. From a Jungian perspective, however, there is a collective symbol system that is alchemical, cross-cultural, universal and reflective of the common archetypes of human experience. Jung claimed that the language of alchemy is privileged and objective. Alchemical symbols tend to occur spontaneously in dreams and in creative works. Psychological interpretations of these they can be more or less rational, meaningful and positive or negative in valence. There are rules to interpretation, but there is always fundamental uncertainty in applying them. Interpretation is as much an art as it is a science. The interpreter brings his or her own orientation, context of interpretation and style to fill in the ambiguities. Interpretation is like co-creation.
And You And I
The unconventional title of this song, "And You And I" (rather than more simply, "You and I") appears to signify an unbroken chain between the "I" and the "Other," a fusion experience of love. "And You and I" is a mystical love song, as well as a song about the psychological process of integrating the Anima (i.e., the unconscious feminine aspect of a man); welcoming the Son of Man into the world; and transcending to a higher state of being and becoming whole.
Cord of Life
A man conceived a moment’s answer to the dream
Staying the flowers daily sensing all the themes
As a foundation left to create the spiral aim
A movement regained and regarded both the same
All complete in the sight of seeds of life with you
A man has had a "big dream" that awakens him to the essential problem of existence. The context of this dream must be that established in "Close to the Edge," a highly metaphoric, dreamlike piece of music referring to the divine work of creation and the plan of salvation within it.
Woman is the entry point into this world. Women, therefore, are traditionally viewed as closer to the mystery and miracle of life (the Great Mother) and more naturally attuned with the undifferentiated oneness of the universe. Flowers are a symbol of the feminine, even of the vagina. The "cord of life" (like the umbilical cord) is a mystical feminine symbol of life’s connection to divinity, mortality and the cycle of birth and death.
With that said, the metaphor, "staying the flowers daily sensing all the themes," appears to imply that the man is looking towards the feminine principle of nature for knowledge. Since "staying" might mean to hold still or to linger, perhaps he is stopping the normal flow, interrupting the essential processes of feminine nature in order to question and sense its themes and motives. The man appears to be a mystic searching for higher consciousness and knowledge of his own repressed feminine aspect, the Anima.
"As a foundation left to create the spiral aim" appears to have multiple meanings. One association is to the mystical spiral, which symbolizes the evolution of consciousness towards the Godhead. Another association is to the double-stranded DNA helix whose "spiral aim" is to reproduce life.
That this is a "movement regained" (as if it had been lost) "and regarded" (as if it is separate from one's self) suggests that it is a fusion experience with an other, lost in infancy as we separate and individuate, but regained in the mature experience of love. That these experiences are "both the same" is the mystical realization that all fusion experience is oneness with the Great Mother. The "foundation left to create the spiral aim" appears to signify a union of masculine and feminine principles, which can lead to both progeny and the development of higher consciousness transcending the narrow boundaries of the ego.
The experience of love (and sexual union) communicated in this song is "all complete in the sight of seeds of life with you." The "sight of seeds of life" might mean the consciousness of as yet unborn progeny or, more abstractly, the original consciousness of God.
Change only for a sight, the sound the space agreed
Between the picture of time behind the face of need
Coming quickly to terms of all expression laid
Emotion revealed as the ocean maid
All complete in the sight of seeds of life with you
The first line communicates an existential rather than material view of space. We co-create reality with the universe, as space, itself, agrees to our experience. Change occurs for the sake of perception and the unfolding of our truth.
The entire universe is the Other that we love, that we relate with, and that we are separate from in time. Our knowledge of our oneness with Her is hidden "between the picture of time behind the face of need," can only be revealed to us by imagining what it is like to be beyond time and beyond need. Time and need are relative aspects of our mortal life that dissolve in Her great being, like a drop of water dissolves in the ocean.
In this life, however, we lack the secure feeling of oneness with Her and we are filled with anxiety and desire. Therefore, we "come quickly to terms of all expression laid," that is, we are attracted to the metaphors or poetic sparks that creative people produce from the unconscious well springs of knowledge of the our oneness with the universe. We love the metaphors or poetic sparks that add value to language by expressing our unconscious emotions and, ultimately, grounded us in being. To a man, these emotions are like the "ocean maid," or mermaid, which represents the Anima or the unconscious feminine aspect of a man. "And You And I" is a love song that is also about the union of masculine and feminine aspects of the Self. Union in truth and love is the answer to the man’s dream. Wholeness is the answer to the man’s dream. Integrating the unconscious, feminine aspect of the Self with the differentiated masculine ego is the answer to the man’s dream.
Coins and crosses
Coins and crosses
Never know their fruitless worth
Cords are broken locked inside the mother earth
They won’t hide hold
They won’t tell you
Watching the world
Watching all of the world
Watching life go by
Coins and crosses both have symbolic value, at least for mortals. "Cords are broken" appears to be a reference to death. From the perspective of the living, the dead are perhaps "locked inside the mother earth." But they do not exist. The metaphors of afterlife are for the living: we need to represent death in this life, although we cannot ever grasp its meaning or its meaninglessness. What worth is there in these empty metaphors, coins and crosses? The dead won’t hide or hold the truth from us, nor will they tell us. But we envision them "watching the world" and watching us go through time.
And you and I climb over the sea to the valley
And you and I reach out for reasons to call
In alchemy, the sea is a metaphor for the unconscious, the maternal, the origin of life. In valley/mountain symbolism, the valley, being low ground, is a metaphor of procreative rather than creative consciousness. On the other hand the hill or mountain, being high ground, is a metaphor of higher consciousness. The valley and the mountain are opposites. Couples live in the valley and procreate; hermits and wise men live on the mountain and contemplate and reflect.
To "climb over the sea" is to overcome a natural barrier, which, in this case, might be a sexual inhibition. Sexual union is probably what occurs in the valley. Lovers procreate and procreation tends to perpetuate a status quo into the next generation and not necessarily to raise consciousness. Procreation is the slow movement towards transcendence.
Eclipse
In alchemy, the moon is "Luna," the feminine principle of divinity, tides, the menstrual cycle, sexuality, procreation and unconsciousness. The sun is Sol, the masculine principle of divinity, energy, growth and consciousness. When the moon eclipses the sun, the feminine principle dominates the masculine principle and procreation tends to occur. Although a beautiful and worthy experience, procreation does not resolve the essential problem of the dream, which is the need for transcendence.
The Preacher and the Teacher
The preacher and the teacher appear to be dual aspects of the archetype of the Son of Man, the redeemer or messianic Hero. The "eclipse" set the contextual need for His entry. A parallelism between these two aspects of the Christ archetype (i.e., preacher and teacher) is spelled out in the first line.
Sad preacher nailed upon the coloured door of time;
insane teacher be there reminded of the rhyme.
The sad preacher is like the crucified Christ. In substitution for the cross, however, he is nailed to the metaphorical "coloured door of time." Man is mortal and the Son of Man is caught in time. The "coloured door of time" might be a metaphor for a transcendent, emotional exit from time. The preacher is nailed to it, perhaps for the same reasons Jesus was nailed to the cross by his fellowmen: for arousing otherworldly desires and fomenting rebellion against conventional religious authority. The preacher approaches transcendence by suffering persecution for his desire to overcome time and transcend mortal limitations.
The teacher is insane precisely because he wants to teach the preacher’s ineffable message, which makes no conventional sense. The teacher wants to teach the emotional meaning of the preacher's suffering, which reminds him of "the rhyme." Note that a rhyme is rhythmic, but may lack rational meaning. The teacher approaches transcendence by attempting to rationalize something that is emotional and beyond the reach of reason, which leads to insanity and suffering.
What is the community's response to these figures?
There’ll be no mutant enemy we shall certify
Political ends, as sad remains, will die.
Reach out as forward tastes begin to enter you.
The masses of old regarded the androgynous, Christ-like man as a "mutant enemy." They crucified Jesus for his difference from them, for his unusual visions and teachings, and for his rebellious moral authority. They perceived him as a threat to the political status quo, to traditional masculinity and to religion.
This new and revolutionary idea, "there’ll be no mutant enemy we shall certify," appears to suggest that the masses will resolve the essential problem of messianic redemption by accepting the Son of Man archetype into the world. This would be a giant step in the evolution of Man, that is, a massive overcoming of the communal impulse to crucify the higher type of man. Let Him live and let the political ends that motivate us to crucify Him die! Then, "reach out" as the higher tastes or preferences that more us forward in evolutionary time enter you. Transcendence will come to all!
In the next stanza, it is made clear that the kind of knowledge of the rhythm of life that is sought is intangible:
I listened hard but could not see, life’s tempo change out and inside me.
Another parallelism:
The preacher trained in all to lose his name; the teacher travels asking to be shown the same.
To lose one’s name is to lose the ego, to lose language, to give up the rational project of using words to objectify and control things and to be objectified and controlled by others. The preacher has trained in "all" to abandon the discrete linguistic objects of this world, including his own ego. He suffers the loss of ego as he strives to be a Self. The Teacher’s ego, on the other hand, is unbound and inflated. The teacher travels to master all things of this world in his efforts to match the preacher. His is a grandiose, Faustian quest that similarly results in suffering.
In the end we'll agree we'll accept, we'll immortalize
That the truth of the man maturing in his eyes
All complete in the sight of seeds of life with you
In conclusion, the answer to the dream does not lie strictly within the Son of Man; it lies with the community. Communal acceptance of His ineffable truth, seen in his eyes, which are the windows to the soul, is the answer to the dream.
Apocalypse
Since transcendence and apocalypse are dual aspects of one process, the final movement is aptly titled for the unconscious, repressed aspect.
And you and I climb crossing the shapes of the morning
And you and I reach over the sun for the river
And you and I climb clearer towards the movement
And you and I called over valleys of endless seas.
In the end, lovers, as one, transcend, rising higher than before, at the dawn of a new collective consciousness and new formal structure of meaning. To "reach over the sun for the river" is to immortalize in a clearer, heavenly realm, where we continue to evolve towards the movement of truth and love.
Comments on my interpretation are welcome
And You And I
The unconventional title of this song, "And You And I" (rather than more simply, "You and I") appears to signify an unbroken chain between the "I" and the "Other," a fusion experience of love. "And You and I" is a mystical love song, as well as a song about the psychological process of integrating the Anima (i.e., the unconscious feminine aspect of a man); welcoming the Son of Man into the world; and transcending to a higher state of being and becoming whole.
Cord of Life
A man conceived a moment’s answer to the dream
Staying the flowers daily sensing all the themes
As a foundation left to create the spiral aim
A movement regained and regarded both the same
All complete in the sight of seeds of life with you
A man has had a "big dream" that awakens him to the essential problem of existence. The context of this dream must be that established in "Close to the Edge," a highly metaphoric, dreamlike piece of music referring to the divine work of creation and the plan of salvation within it.
Woman is the entry point into this world. Women, therefore, are traditionally viewed as closer to the mystery and miracle of life (the Great Mother) and more naturally attuned with the undifferentiated oneness of the universe. Flowers are a symbol of the feminine, even of the vagina. The "cord of life" (like the umbilical cord) is a mystical feminine symbol of life’s connection to divinity, mortality and the cycle of birth and death.
With that said, the metaphor, "staying the flowers daily sensing all the themes," appears to imply that the man is looking towards the feminine principle of nature for knowledge. Since "staying" might mean to hold still or to linger, perhaps he is stopping the normal flow, interrupting the essential processes of feminine nature in order to question and sense its themes and motives. The man appears to be a mystic searching for higher consciousness and knowledge of his own repressed feminine aspect, the Anima.
"As a foundation left to create the spiral aim" appears to have multiple meanings. One association is to the mystical spiral, which symbolizes the evolution of consciousness towards the Godhead. Another association is to the double-stranded DNA helix whose "spiral aim" is to reproduce life.
That this is a "movement regained" (as if it had been lost) "and regarded" (as if it is separate from one's self) suggests that it is a fusion experience with an other, lost in infancy as we separate and individuate, but regained in the mature experience of love. That these experiences are "both the same" is the mystical realization that all fusion experience is oneness with the Great Mother. The "foundation left to create the spiral aim" appears to signify a union of masculine and feminine principles, which can lead to both progeny and the development of higher consciousness transcending the narrow boundaries of the ego.
The experience of love (and sexual union) communicated in this song is "all complete in the sight of seeds of life with you." The "sight of seeds of life" might mean the consciousness of as yet unborn progeny or, more abstractly, the original consciousness of God.
Change only for a sight, the sound the space agreed
Between the picture of time behind the face of need
Coming quickly to terms of all expression laid
Emotion revealed as the ocean maid
All complete in the sight of seeds of life with you
The first line communicates an existential rather than material view of space. We co-create reality with the universe, as space, itself, agrees to our experience. Change occurs for the sake of perception and the unfolding of our truth.
The entire universe is the Other that we love, that we relate with, and that we are separate from in time. Our knowledge of our oneness with Her is hidden "between the picture of time behind the face of need," can only be revealed to us by imagining what it is like to be beyond time and beyond need. Time and need are relative aspects of our mortal life that dissolve in Her great being, like a drop of water dissolves in the ocean.
In this life, however, we lack the secure feeling of oneness with Her and we are filled with anxiety and desire. Therefore, we "come quickly to terms of all expression laid," that is, we are attracted to the metaphors or poetic sparks that creative people produce from the unconscious well springs of knowledge of the our oneness with the universe. We love the metaphors or poetic sparks that add value to language by expressing our unconscious emotions and, ultimately, grounded us in being. To a man, these emotions are like the "ocean maid," or mermaid, which represents the Anima or the unconscious feminine aspect of a man. "And You And I" is a love song that is also about the union of masculine and feminine aspects of the Self. Union in truth and love is the answer to the man’s dream. Wholeness is the answer to the man’s dream. Integrating the unconscious, feminine aspect of the Self with the differentiated masculine ego is the answer to the man’s dream.
Coins and crosses
Coins and crosses
Never know their fruitless worth
Cords are broken locked inside the mother earth
They won’t hide hold
They won’t tell you
Watching the world
Watching all of the world
Watching life go by
Coins and crosses both have symbolic value, at least for mortals. "Cords are broken" appears to be a reference to death. From the perspective of the living, the dead are perhaps "locked inside the mother earth." But they do not exist. The metaphors of afterlife are for the living: we need to represent death in this life, although we cannot ever grasp its meaning or its meaninglessness. What worth is there in these empty metaphors, coins and crosses? The dead won’t hide or hold the truth from us, nor will they tell us. But we envision them "watching the world" and watching us go through time.
And you and I climb over the sea to the valley
And you and I reach out for reasons to call
In alchemy, the sea is a metaphor for the unconscious, the maternal, the origin of life. In valley/mountain symbolism, the valley, being low ground, is a metaphor of procreative rather than creative consciousness. On the other hand the hill or mountain, being high ground, is a metaphor of higher consciousness. The valley and the mountain are opposites. Couples live in the valley and procreate; hermits and wise men live on the mountain and contemplate and reflect.
To "climb over the sea" is to overcome a natural barrier, which, in this case, might be a sexual inhibition. Sexual union is probably what occurs in the valley. Lovers procreate and procreation tends to perpetuate a status quo into the next generation and not necessarily to raise consciousness. Procreation is the slow movement towards transcendence.
Eclipse
In alchemy, the moon is "Luna," the feminine principle of divinity, tides, the menstrual cycle, sexuality, procreation and unconsciousness. The sun is Sol, the masculine principle of divinity, energy, growth and consciousness. When the moon eclipses the sun, the feminine principle dominates the masculine principle and procreation tends to occur. Although a beautiful and worthy experience, procreation does not resolve the essential problem of the dream, which is the need for transcendence.
The Preacher and the Teacher
The preacher and the teacher appear to be dual aspects of the archetype of the Son of Man, the redeemer or messianic Hero. The "eclipse" set the contextual need for His entry. A parallelism between these two aspects of the Christ archetype (i.e., preacher and teacher) is spelled out in the first line.
Sad preacher nailed upon the coloured door of time;
insane teacher be there reminded of the rhyme.
The sad preacher is like the crucified Christ. In substitution for the cross, however, he is nailed to the metaphorical "coloured door of time." Man is mortal and the Son of Man is caught in time. The "coloured door of time" might be a metaphor for a transcendent, emotional exit from time. The preacher is nailed to it, perhaps for the same reasons Jesus was nailed to the cross by his fellowmen: for arousing otherworldly desires and fomenting rebellion against conventional religious authority. The preacher approaches transcendence by suffering persecution for his desire to overcome time and transcend mortal limitations.
The teacher is insane precisely because he wants to teach the preacher’s ineffable message, which makes no conventional sense. The teacher wants to teach the emotional meaning of the preacher's suffering, which reminds him of "the rhyme." Note that a rhyme is rhythmic, but may lack rational meaning. The teacher approaches transcendence by attempting to rationalize something that is emotional and beyond the reach of reason, which leads to insanity and suffering.
What is the community's response to these figures?
There’ll be no mutant enemy we shall certify
Political ends, as sad remains, will die.
Reach out as forward tastes begin to enter you.
The masses of old regarded the androgynous, Christ-like man as a "mutant enemy." They crucified Jesus for his difference from them, for his unusual visions and teachings, and for his rebellious moral authority. They perceived him as a threat to the political status quo, to traditional masculinity and to religion.
This new and revolutionary idea, "there’ll be no mutant enemy we shall certify," appears to suggest that the masses will resolve the essential problem of messianic redemption by accepting the Son of Man archetype into the world. This would be a giant step in the evolution of Man, that is, a massive overcoming of the communal impulse to crucify the higher type of man. Let Him live and let the political ends that motivate us to crucify Him die! Then, "reach out" as the higher tastes or preferences that more us forward in evolutionary time enter you. Transcendence will come to all!
In the next stanza, it is made clear that the kind of knowledge of the rhythm of life that is sought is intangible:
I listened hard but could not see, life’s tempo change out and inside me.
Another parallelism:
The preacher trained in all to lose his name; the teacher travels asking to be shown the same.
To lose one’s name is to lose the ego, to lose language, to give up the rational project of using words to objectify and control things and to be objectified and controlled by others. The preacher has trained in "all" to abandon the discrete linguistic objects of this world, including his own ego. He suffers the loss of ego as he strives to be a Self. The Teacher’s ego, on the other hand, is unbound and inflated. The teacher travels to master all things of this world in his efforts to match the preacher. His is a grandiose, Faustian quest that similarly results in suffering.
In the end we'll agree we'll accept, we'll immortalize
That the truth of the man maturing in his eyes
All complete in the sight of seeds of life with you
In conclusion, the answer to the dream does not lie strictly within the Son of Man; it lies with the community. Communal acceptance of His ineffable truth, seen in his eyes, which are the windows to the soul, is the answer to the dream.
Apocalypse
Since transcendence and apocalypse are dual aspects of one process, the final movement is aptly titled for the unconscious, repressed aspect.
And you and I climb crossing the shapes of the morning
And you and I reach over the sun for the river
And you and I climb clearer towards the movement
And you and I called over valleys of endless seas.
In the end, lovers, as one, transcend, rising higher than before, at the dawn of a new collective consciousness and new formal structure of meaning. To "reach over the sun for the river" is to immortalize in a clearer, heavenly realm, where we continue to evolve towards the movement of truth and love.
Comments on my interpretation are welcome